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[openstack-dev] [tc][election] Question for candidates: How do you think we can make our community more inclusive?

0 votes

Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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asked Oct 24, 2017 in openstack-dev by Flavio_Percoco (36,960 points)   3 7 11

23 Responses

0 votes

Hi Flavio,

I would like to refer to another thread about areas the TC should be more active in raised by Ed Leafe where trust and mentorship were brought up by a few of us.

I think one of the key factors of being open and inclusive is to help and mentor new contributors/community members regardless where and who they are.

To mention examples, we have several places around the globe with time zones we didn’t necessarily keep in mind in the past or areas where language barriers are higher. I think we need to spend time on understanding what the barriers might be that keep people back from actively participating in the community while we are thinking about actions.

Seeing the activity on the #openstack-tc channel I think that’s a great example of how to involve and engage more people in the different discussions by removing the dedicated meeting slot and switch to office hours and providing a forum where TC members are available to everyone.

We have a new proposal to create a SIG called (something like) 'First Contact SIG’. I hope discussions on diversity and inclusiveness will come up there with the people who are passionate about on-boarding. As joining an open environment can be challenging and intimidating having people who are eager to help visible and accessible is crucial.

To the margin, I think on the technology side we are progressing well, so I would not reflect on that in this thread.

Thanks and Best Regards,
Ildikó

On 2017. Oct 13., at 14:45, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:

Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by Ildiko_Vancsa (2,220 points)   1 2
0 votes

Greetings Flavio,

My perception is that if we need to encourage the spreading of task, roles,
responsibility amongst many. In other words, encourage building trust.
Building trust should hopefully foster a personal sense of investment
and responsibility, hopefully resulting in further diversity as time goes by
improving contributor retention.

That being said, I think step zero would be an assessment of what data is
available and the identification of what is missing from the puzzle.

-Julia

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 5:45 AM, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:
Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this
is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how
you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by Julia_Kreger (1,460 points)   3
0 votes

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 02:45:28PM +0200, Flavio Percoco wrote:
Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

I admit, I didn't include this topic in my email. And I'll be the first to say
inclusiveness is an import and healthy issue to have for any project / society.

Listening, and learning, what makes people comfortable to engage and contribute
would be on my list. This applied both to any project and persons. I'd learn
how other projects are responding to the topic and possible engage with those
leaders to share successes.


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by pabelanger_at_redhat (6,560 points)   1 1 2
0 votes

On 13/10/17 13:45, Flavio Percoco wrote:
Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe
this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all,
how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco

Honestly, short of the the (already in progress) work to help new
contributors getting on board I do not know what the best way is.

But - that is down to me matching the "stereotypical" software engineer
image people have - I did not have to work as hard to become part of the
community as the people we are trying to encourage to join us will have
to, and have had to already to get to a point where they want to join
us.

So - how could we make our community more inclusive?

Ask, and listen to the problems people joining us in the past have had.
Then use that information to find a solution.
Iterate, find the next problem.
Try to solve it.
Repeat.
Profit?

OK ^ is a bit glib. But, this is not something we are going to solve in
a cycle, or even a year - it will be a long term project, and someone
like me, speaking from a position of privilege, about how to fix it is
not how we should try to improve our situation.


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by gr_at_ham.ie (620 points)  
0 votes

Excerpts from Flavio Percoco's message of 2017-10-13 14:45:28 +0200:

Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

If I had a magic wand, I would use it to find all of the -1 reviews
in gerrit for typos, wording clarifications, markup corrections,
variable naming disagreements, and other minor issues and turn them
into +1/+2 votes with a follow-up patch from the reviewer to fix
the problems.

I think this one small change would transform our review culture
from one of "seeking perfection in others" to "helping each other
find perfection together", and the result would make us more welcoming
to contributors of all types.

Doug


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by Doug_Hellmann (87,520 points)   3 4 9
0 votes

Flavio,

Some months back I looked at a slide that Thierry showed at a meeting;
it showed contributor statistics and it showed that there were a large
number of contributors who made exactly 1 commit which sometimes got
merged, but there was a huge drop off from 1 commit to 2 commits!

So I got to thinking about what could cause that and how one could get
to the second commit (once you're hooked, you are hooked!).

To that end, I tried to give priority to first time committers; if I
saw a commit that said "New Contributor", I try to not only thank them
for it, but also be much more responsive. I hope that helped at least
one contributor go from 1st commit to 2nd commit.

Other than that, working (with Dims) trying to take up a number of
initiatives that bring new contributors to OpenStack including

  • speaking to university students (a project I proposed a while back
    called OpenStack in the classroom[1])
  • making presentations at Summit(s) meetups, and any other place which
    will have us to tell people about OpenStack[2].
  • participate (as a mentor) in the OpenStack mentorship program, the
    Women of OpenStack program, and a myriad of other non-OpenStack
    community development programs

Shameless plug for Dims & my presentation at Summit in Sydney about
contributing to OpenStack [2].

Thanks for the question!

-amrith

[1] http://openstack.markmail.org/thread/qadfotwkoj6alivj
[2] https://www.openstack.org/summit/sydney-2017/summit-schedule/events/19116/getting-started-with-contributing-to-openstack-dos-and-donts

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 8:45 AM, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:
Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this
is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how
you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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Unsubscribe: OpenStack-dev-request@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe
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responded Oct 13, 2017 by amrith.kumar_at_gmai (3,580 points)   2 3
0 votes

Excerpts from Amrith Kumar's message of 2017-10-13 13:32:54 -0400:

Flavio,

Some months back I looked at a slide that Thierry showed at a meeting;
it showed contributor statistics and it showed that there were a large
number of contributors who made exactly 1 commit which sometimes got
merged, but there was a huge drop off from 1 commit to 2 commits!

So I got to thinking about what could cause that and how one could get
to the second commit (once you're hooked, you are hooked!).

To that end, I tried to give priority to first time committers; if I
saw a commit that said "New Contributor", I try to not only thank them
for it, but also be much more responsive. I hope that helped at least
one contributor go from 1st commit to 2nd commit.

This is a great point. It's easy to find new contributors because
we have a bot that drops a welcome message on their patch, and
gerrit can query by reviewer:

https://review.openstack.org/#/q/reviewer:%22Welcome%252C+new+contributor!%22+status:open,n,z

Other than that, working (with Dims) trying to take up a number of
initiatives that bring new contributors to OpenStack including

  • speaking to university students (a project I proposed a while back
    called OpenStack in the classroom[1])
  • making presentations at Summit(s) meetups, and any other place which
    will have us to tell people about OpenStack[2].
  • participate (as a mentor) in the OpenStack mentorship program, the
    Women of OpenStack program, and a myriad of other non-OpenStack
    community development programs

Shameless plug for Dims & my presentation at Summit in Sydney about
contributing to OpenStack [2].

Thanks for the question!

-amrith

[1] http://openstack.markmail.org/thread/qadfotwkoj6alivj
[2] https://www.openstack.org/summit/sydney-2017/summit-schedule/events/19116/getting-started-with-contributing-to-openstack-dos-and-donts

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 8:45 AM, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:

Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this
is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how
you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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Unsubscribe: OpenStack-dev-request@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe
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responded Oct 13, 2017 by Doug_Hellmann (87,520 points)   3 4 9
0 votes

Thanks Doug, I didn't know what caused the "Welcome New Contributor"
thing show up in reviews, but that is exactly what I used to look for.

-amrith

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Doug Hellmann doug@doughellmann.com wrote:
Excerpts from Amrith Kumar's message of 2017-10-13 13:32:54 -0400:

Flavio,

Some months back I looked at a slide that Thierry showed at a meeting;
it showed contributor statistics and it showed that there were a large
number of contributors who made exactly 1 commit which sometimes got
merged, but there was a huge drop off from 1 commit to 2 commits!

So I got to thinking about what could cause that and how one could get
to the second commit (once you're hooked, you are hooked!).

To that end, I tried to give priority to first time committers; if I
saw a commit that said "New Contributor", I try to not only thank them
for it, but also be much more responsive. I hope that helped at least
one contributor go from 1st commit to 2nd commit.

This is a great point. It's easy to find new contributors because
we have a bot that drops a welcome message on their patch, and
gerrit can query by reviewer:

https://review.openstack.org/#/q/reviewer:%22Welcome%252C+new+contributor!%22+status:open,n,z

Other than that, working (with Dims) trying to take up a number of
initiatives that bring new contributors to OpenStack including

  • speaking to university students (a project I proposed a while back
    called OpenStack in the classroom[1])
  • making presentations at Summit(s) meetups, and any other place which
    will have us to tell people about OpenStack[2].
  • participate (as a mentor) in the OpenStack mentorship program, the
    Women of OpenStack program, and a myriad of other non-OpenStack
    community development programs

Shameless plug for Dims & my presentation at Summit in Sydney about
contributing to OpenStack [2].

Thanks for the question!

-amrith

[1] http://openstack.markmail.org/thread/qadfotwkoj6alivj
[2] https://www.openstack.org/summit/sydney-2017/summit-schedule/events/19116/getting-started-with-contributing-to-openstack-dos-and-donts

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 8:45 AM, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:

Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this
is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how
you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by amrith.kumar_at_gmai (3,580 points)   2 3
0 votes

Thanks for asking, Flavio. That's one of the topic I mentioned in my
candidacy, that's because as a Chinese working on OpenStack in the past
6 years, I do have some experiences about this though I agree it
couldn't be done in 1 cycle/year. But I think it's still a domain I can
contribute for OpenStack.

I can still remember I had to join the Glance meeting at 2:00AM, and was
challenged because of saying "Hi guys" in a public channel though "Hi
guys" is used very common in New Zealand. Should we expect a non-English
native speaker to understand the details between “Hi there", "Hi guys"
and "Hi folks"? I think that's the language and culture barrier for many
new contributors. We (Brian, Erno) even tried to propose a panel at
summit to discuss it before. Currently, it's more important than ever to
keep those new contributors due to the changes happening around
OpenStack nowadays.

On 14/10/17 01:45, Flavio Percoco wrote:
Greetings,

Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness
(or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe
this is a
broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from
y'all, how you
think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve
first?

Thank you,
Flavio

--
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco


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--
Cheers & Best regards,
Feilong Wang (王飞龙)


Senior Cloud Software Engineer
Tel: +64-48032246
Email: flwang@catalyst.net.nz
Catalyst IT Limited
Level 6, Catalyst House, 150 Willis Street, Wellington


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by Fei_Long_Wang (4,460 points)   3 3
0 votes

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 5:45 AM, Flavio Percoco flavio@redhat.com wrote:
Some of you, TC candidates, expressed concerns about diversity and
inclusiveness (or inclusivity, depending on your taste) in your candidacy. I believe this
is a broad, and some times ill-used, topic so, I'd like to know, from y'all, how
you think we could make our community more inclusive. What areas would you
improve first?

Some rough ideas, that can be discussed as a community:

  • Force changes in leadership roles: I'm believe in rotations when
    that makes sense. We could think at some policy to not being at TC
    more than 2 cycles in a row (can re-apply after one cycle break). Same
    for PTL? (not sure on this one, some projects don't have much
    volunteers do run this position). But you get the idea.
    (some could ask why I didn't propose that during my TC mandate, it
    just popup in my mind by writing this email).

  • Keep encouraging asynchronous collaboration: dropping the TC meeting
    (and adding office hours) was a good example of how we can now have
    TC-related discussions around the globe without having to stay until
    late in the evening. I would like to encourage other projects to look
    at this concept. Hopefully we can get more contributors from around
    the globe and not just in US-friendly timezone.

  • Ensure projects growth: the number of core reviewers for some
    projects is imho alarming. Lack of reviewers? Lack of trust? Here are
    some number of the Top 5 projects (# of reviews in Pike, source
    stackalitics):

1 Nova - 12 cores

2 Infra - 13 cores (core, not root)

3 Cinder - 15 cores

4 Neutron - 13 cores (not counting all plugins repos, but numbers

look good, probably thanks to the stadium)

5 TripleO - 32

(and we can continue)

What TC can do? promote more mentoring, establish healthy policies to
promote cores in projects, by defining as a community the metrics
used, etc.

Anyway, these things are (again) rough ideas, that we can be discussed
here or somewhere else but I strongly believe we need people at TC who
can, by their experience and motivation, make our community growing in
healthy and diverse ways.
--
Emilien Macchi


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responded Oct 13, 2017 by emilien_at_redhat.co (36,940 points)   2 6 9
...